Mighty God, Eternal Father - before Abraham was born, I am.

[biblebuf]

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Mighty God, Eternal Father - before Abraham was born, I am.

NAS

For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.  (Isa. 9:6 )
"Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one! (Deut. 6:4 )
  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (John 1:1)
 For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form,  (Col. 2:9 )
 “I and the Father are one.”… but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father." (John 10:30, 38 )
  So they were saying to Him, "Where is Your Father?" Jesus answered, "You know neither Me nor My Father; if you knew Me, you would know My Father also."  (John 8:19 )
 Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us." Jesus said to him, "Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?    (John 14:8, 9 )
 And again, "I WILL PUT MY TRUST IN HIM." And again, "BEHOLD, I AND THE CHILDREN WHOM GOD HAS GIVEN ME." (Heb. 2:13 )
 As a result of the anguish of His soul, He will see it and be satisfied; By His knowledge the Righteous One, My Servant, will justify the many, As He will bear their iniquities. (Isa. 53:11 )
 "I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."   (Rev. 1:8 )
 Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."  (John. 8:58 )
 God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM"; and He said, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.'" (Exo. 3:14 )
 "There is no one holy like the LORD, Indeed, there is no one besides You, Nor is there any rock like our God. (1Sa 2:2)
But of the Son He says, "YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. (Heb. 1:8 )
 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.  (Col. 1:17 )

[Hal]

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Trinity

It's all in the book, why do so many argue with the word?

[biblebuf]

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Trinity

It's all in the book, why do so many argue with the word?

You have to admit Hal, it's a hard concept to understand.

[Hal]

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You have to admit Hal, it's a hard concept to understand.

 Admittedly so 😇

[Moss]

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He was-He is-He will always be.

And as such He will never leave us.

[CowboyGH]

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 John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.


14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.


Jesus has always existed, he has always been. If you'll notice even in the OT some verses says God said or did this, then some will say "LORD God" said this or that, ect.

[Fat]

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Hi CowboyGH - welcome

1 Corinthians 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

Colossians 1:16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.

Hebrews 1:2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

[CowboyGH]

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Howdy fat, this is where context comes into play and the meanings of words.

The following verse explains why he's referred to as the "son" of God. And the references of Son/Father. But keep in mind we know the Word was in the beginning, then the Word was made flesh eg., Jesus. He may have taken on a different form, but he is still the same being/existence.

Philippians 2:7

7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

God =
 3
:  a being or thing of supreme value

4
:  a powerful ruler

Thus why Jesus is our God eg., do not tempt the LORD "thy" God. And also why he referred to his father as God. For he came as a "servant", so therefore being a servant he would have a "master" or "ruler" for the time being while he was in that form, thus why again he referred to his father as his God. But he never refers to his father as our God. Notice the latter part of 1 Corinthians 8:6. "There is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live". Explains that Jesus created all things. Which is entirely shown in Genesis in chapter 2 when it refers to "LORD God" created this or that. And a little further, the latter part of Hebrews again explains all things are/were created through Jesus Christ "his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe."

Hi CowboyGH - welcome

1 Corinthians 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

Colossians 1:16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.

Hebrews 1:2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

[Fat]

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Howdy fat, this is where context comes into play and the meanings of words.

The following verse explains why he's referred to as the "son" of God. And the references of Son/Father. But keep in mind we know the Word was in the beginning, then the Word was made flesh eg., Jesus. He may have taken on a different form, but he is still the same being/existence.

Philippians 2:7

7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

God =
 3
:  a being or thing of supreme value

4
:  a powerful ruler

Thus why Jesus is our God eg., do not tempt the LORD "thy" God. And also why he referred to his father as God. For he came as a "servant", so therefore being a servant he would have a "master" or "ruler" for the time being while he was in that form, thus why again he referred to his father as his God. But he never refers to his father as our God. Notice the latter part of 1 Corinthians 8:6. "There is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live". Explains that Jesus created all things. Which is entirely shown in Genesis in chapter 2 when it refers to "LORD God" created this or that. And a little further, the latter part of Hebrews again explains all things are/were created through Jesus Christ "his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe."

The day before yesterday two Jehovah's Witnesses showed up to my door telling me they wanted to discuss the Bible with me so I may learn the truth. They brought with them their New World Translation. I told him that we had a real problem because of their translation of John 1:1. They were aware of the translation differences in John 1 and were ready to discuss them with me with smiles and confidence. I knew that they were about to get in to the language minutia in the translation of the old Greek. So I asked them if their Jesus was a good man and they replied of course. I said you are right and I back this up with their translation of 1 Peter 1:19.

1 Peter 1:19 But it was with precious blood, like that of an unblemished and spotless lamb, that of Christ. (NWT)

I then asked them to read to me Mark 10:18 from their Bible.

Mark 10:18 Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good except one, God. (NWT)

I then asked them how their Christ to be worthy he was not good, and they responded saying that my verses being taken out of context and I asked to put it in context for me, but she just smiled and said I don't want to talk about this.

So I said well there's something else you can help me with, I find another discrepancy in your translation and I pointed to John 14:6

Jesus said to him: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. (NWT)

And John 6:44, 65 (NWT)

44 No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him, and I will resurrect him on the last day.

65  He went on to say: “This is why I have said to you, no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”

She went on to try and make the argument that I cannot dispute this because my Bible translated these verses almost identically. Again reminded her that my Bible does not have a conflict with these verses because it translated John 1:1 correctly which put my Bible in sync but left her Bible in chaos.

The two ladies then walk away shaken one saying to me you're just trying to destroy my faith, to which I replied I was trying to give you the truth.

[CowboyGH]

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The day before yesterday two Jehovah's Witnesses showed up to my door telling me they wanted to discuss the Bible with me so I may learn the truth. They brought with them their New World Translation. I told him that we had a real problem because of their translation of John 1:1. They were aware of the translation differences in John 1 and were ready to discuss them with me with smiles and confidence. I knew that they were about to get in to the language minutia in the translation of the old Greek. So I asked them if their Jesus was a good man and they replied of course. I said you are right and I back this up with their translation of 1 Peter 1:19.

1 Peter 1:19 But it was with precious blood, like that of an unblemished and spotless lamb, that of Christ. (NWT)

I then asked them to read to me Mark 10:18 from their Bible.

Mark 10:18 Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good except one, God. (NWT)

I then asked them how their Christ to be worthy he was not good, and they responded saying that my verses being taken out of context and I asked to put it in context for me, but she just smiled and said I don't want to talk about this.

So I said well there's something else you can help me with, I find another discrepancy in your translation and I pointed to John 14:6

Jesus said to him: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. (NWT)

And John 6:44, 65 (NWT)

44 No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him, and I will resurrect him on the last day.

65  He went on to say: “This is why I have said to you, no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”

She went on to try and make the argument that I cannot dispute this because my Bible translated these verses almost identically. Again reminded her that my Bible does not have a conflict with these verses because it translated John 1:1 correctly which put my Bible in sync but left her Bible in chaos.

The two ladies then walk away shaken one saying to me you're just trying to destroy my faith, to which I replied I was trying to give you the truth.

First thing I wish to say, is that Jehovah witnesses aren't "Christian" persay. They don't believe Jesus to be God. They believe him just a mortal man with good morals. And yes those verses you quoted go along with Jesus claiming "The father and I are one". The word(s) translated into this, are not referring to physical properties, but rather emotional, mindset, goals, ect. And your reference of Jesus being a good man, yes he did claim not to be "good", for only the father is good. He said this because he was being meek and humble, he was giving the glory to his father. Jesus lived as an example, he praised his God, his father, all through everything he said giving him praise. Just as we are too. Only difference is we are not brothers and sisters with Jesus. For he was the one that created us and everything else. Jesus is our father.