Bible Talk > Eschatology
The prophetic chronological order of end time events
Defacto:
--- Quote from: Bob on December 27, 2016, 09:13:11 am --- So you believe that the Muslims will hold the temple mount from this day until the second coming?
--- End quote ---
Hi Bob,
The "he" [Antichrist] in Dan.9:27 will confirm a covenant/firm agreement, with many for one week. In which from prophecy, Israel will be able to build the tribulation temple described at this site in another thread. According to Mosaic Law, it ust be built in Jerusalem, nowhere else. According to prophecy, that temple will indeed be built, as recorded in 2 Thess.2:4 as well as in Rev.11:1-2, in addition to Dan.9:27 and Mt.24:15 and Mk.13:14. In the middle of the week, the Antichrist will break his covenant with Israel and take full control of the temple Israel built, calling himself God, remaining in his control until Jesus returns in His second coming, as recorded in Rev.19:11-21.
My apology. I did not properly word this prophetic time frame previously.
Defacto
Defacto:
--- Quote from: biblebuf on December 27, 2016, 02:37:46 pm ---Hello Defacto
After 3 ½ years the Antichrist will stop the sacrifice and offering in the temple declaring that he is God.
He will confirm a covenant with many for one 'seven.' In the middle of the 'seven' he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on a wing of the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him" (Daniel 9:27).
Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God (2 Thessalonians 2:3-4).
Are you telling us that the Jews will be sacrificing and giving offerings in a Muslin temple?
--- End quote ---
Hi biblebuf,
Yesw indeed, that is an accurate assessment of the Scriptures except for one point. In 2 Thess.2:3, the word used in present day Bibles, such as rebellion. falling away and apostasy are mistranslations from that of the historic originl as documented in the following, and how it is confirmed in verses 7-8:
2 Thess.2:1-8: The precise timing of the rapture of the Church:
"Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the Day of the Lord [The 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation of Dan.9:27] has already come." 2 Thes.2:1-2. Which is a direct reference to 1 Thes.4:17 and the theme of Paul's entire pre-trib rapture message in 2 Thes.2:1-8. When we will be CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM IN THE CLOUDS TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR. [Parenthetics mine].
The "Day of the Lord" Paul refers to in verse 2, alludes to Dan.9:27, when God will intervene into the affairs of man for the last time, culminating in the second coming of Jesus to the earth. In that passage of Scripture, the Day of the Lord is triggered by the "he" who "confirms a covenant [An agreement] for one Week" [The Day of the Lord/ 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation], who is the antichrist. The second, and same "he," who stops Israel from the offerings and sacrificing in the temple of God, and the third, and same "he," who breaks his covenant in the middle of the Week [After 3.5 of the 7 year total], and sets up the abomination of desolation Jesus referred to in Mt.24:15, in His Olivet Discourse, about the sign of His second coming, and of the end of the age.
In verse 3: "Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that Day [The Day of the Lord, the 70th and final Week, the seven year tribulation] will not come, until the "apostasia" [Greek term in which the original translation was "to depart," or "departure," meaning, the rapture of the Church] occurs and the man of lawlessness [The antichrist, and all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27] is revealed [Who triggers the Day of the Lord/ the 70th and final Week/ the seven year tribulation], the man doomed to destruction." Which reveals the "apostasia" [Departure] will take place before the antichrist is revealed, who triggers the 70th Week/seven year tribulation. Confirmed in verses 7 and 8 below.
Translation History of apostasia and discessio in 2 Thess.2:3: By Thomas Ice, PhD.
The first seven English translations of apostasia all rendered the noun as either " departure" or " departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608) . This supports the notion that the word truly means " departure." In fact, Jerome' s Latin translation known as the Vulgate from around the time of 325 A.D. renders apostasia with the " word discessio, meaning ' departure.' Why was the King James Version the first to depart from the established translation of "departure" in 1611 A.D.? [It is more than likely due to overzealous RCC scribes who altered the original wording of verse 3. to accommodate their teachings of Amillenialism, which rejects both the pre-trib rapture of the Church as well as Jesus Millennial reign her on earth].
Theodore Beza, the Swiss reformer was the first to transliterate apostasia and create a new word, rather than translate it as others had done. The translators of the King James Version were the first to introduce the new rendering of apostasia as " falling away." Most English translators have followed the KJV and Beza in departing from translating apostasia as " departure." No reason was ever given.
"He [The antichrist] will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God." Verse 4. [The abomination of desolation, confirming Dan.9:27 and Mt.24:15]. See also 2 Thes.2:4.
The rapture of the Church and verse 3 confirmed:
In verse 7: "For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will conterienue to do so until he [The saints - Church] is taken out of the way."
The "he" who will be taken out of the way, is the one body of Christ, who bear the Holy Spirit within each of us [Eph.1:13-14], the Church of Jesus Christ. The very same as those who will participate in the "apostasia," the "departure," [the rapture] of the Church, in verse 3. Immediately following that:
In verse 8: "And then the lawless one [The antichrist] will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of His mouth and destroy by the splendor of His coming." Vs 8. [See Rev.19:17-21].
The antichrist is found in all three of the "he's" in Dan. 9:27, confirmed by Jesus in Mt.24:15; Mk.13:14 and by Paul, in 2 Thes.2:3, 4 and 8.
Defacto
biblebuf:
Hello Defacto
FYI I use the NAS or HCS as a study bible.
Your post does not really address when the new Temple will be built. We know for a fact that it has to be built before the rapture, and this is indisputable.
Revelation 11:1 Then there was given me a measuring rod like a staff; and someone said, "Get up and measure the temple of God and the altar, and those who worship in it. 2 "Leave out the court which is outside the temple and do not measure it, for it has been given to the nations; and they will tread under foot the holy city for forty-two months. 3 "And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth."
Just taking a wild guess that the outside court will be given to the Muslims for place of worship. Could this be part of the two state solution that the United Nations is so intent to impose on Israel? But there is no doubt that before the 1260 days start the Temple has already been rebuilt.
Shalom
BB
P. S. Please do not turn this into a discussion about replacement theology, that is replacing the Temple with the Church.
Defacto:
--- Quote from: biblebuf on December 28, 2016, 05:07:11 pm ---Hello Defacto
FYI I use the NAS or HCS as a study bible.
Your post does not really address when the new Temple will be built. We know for a fact that it has to be built before the rapture, and this is indisputable.
Revelation 11:1 Then there was given me a measuring rod like a staff; and someone said, "Get up and measure the temple of God and the altar, and those who worship in it. 2 "Leave out the court which is outside the temple and do not measure it, for it has been given to the nations; and they will tread under foot the holy city for forty-two months. 3 "And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth."
Just taking a wild guess that the outside court will be given to the Muslims for place of worship. Could this be part of the two state solution that the United Nations is so intent to impose on Israel? But there is no doubt that before the 1260 days start the Temple has already been rebuilt.
Shalom
BB
P. S. Please do not turn this into a discussion about replacement theology, that is replacing the Temple with the Church.
--- End quote ---
Hi biblebuf,
The purpose of my last post you responded to above, was to expose the present day mistranslation of 2 Thess.2:3 in our present day Bibles, as revealed through the translation history of it. There was no intent to address the issue of the two temples yet to be built in Jerusalem as covered in my OP in that thread was.
According to the Bible, the outer court of the tribulation temple will be given to the Gentiles for 42 months, 1260 days, same difference, as all of mankind are called, except the Jews, not only the Muslims. In this particular case, it will be the ten horns/nation armies allied to the Antichrist and the False Prophet
IMHO, there will never be a Palestinian state provided by Israel. The UN attempt to make Israel return all the land they won in the '67 war is ridiculous. What country who has won land during warfare has ever had to give it back to whom they won it from?
Defacto.
Fat:
--- Quote --- IMHO, there will never be a Palestinian state provided by Israel. The UN attempt to make Israel return all the land they won in the '67 war is ridiculous. What country who has won land during warfare has ever had to give it back to whom they won it from?
--- End quote ---
Looks like Netanyahu is willing to do it.
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