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The Times of the Gentiles

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Intojoy:

An area of introductory material needed for the understanding of prophecy involves the understanding of the nature and the course of the Times of the Gentiles.

A definition of the term “Times of the Gentiles” can be gleaned from Luke 21:24: And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led captive into all the nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled. The times of the Gentiles can best be defined as that long period of time from the Babylonian Empire to the Second Coming of the Messiah, during which time the Gentiles will have dominance over the City of Jerusalem. This does not rule out temporary Jewish control of the city, but all such Jewish control will be temporary until the Second Coming of the Messiah. Such temporary control was exercised during the Maccabbean period (164-63 B.C.), the First Jewish Revolt against Rome (A.D. 66-70), the Second Jewish Revolt against Rome, also known as the Bar Cochba Revolt (A.D. 132-135), and since 1967 as a result of the Six-Day War. This, too, is temporary, as Gentiles will yet tread down Jerusalem for at least another 31⁄ 2 years (Rev. 11:1-2). Any Jewish takeover of the City of Jerusalem before the Second Coming of the Messiah must, therefore, be viewed as a temporary one and does not mean that the Times of the Gentiles have ended. The Times of the Gentiles can only end when the Gentiles can no longer tread down the City of Jerusalem.

 

 

macuser:

 "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place." (Luke 21:32)  And in the Scriptures, a generation is about 40 years. 1967 to 2007 is 40 years. Granted in this modern age this generation could live on to 2067, but Biblically this generation is now.

Intojoy:

The Matthew account reads: Now from the fig tree learn her parable: when her branch is now become tender, and puts forth its leaves, ye know that the summer is nigh; even so ye also, when ye see all these things, know ye that he is nigh, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

The Luke account reads: And he spoke to them a parable: Behold the fig tree, and all the trees: when they now shoot forth, ye see it and know of your own selves that the summer is now nigh. Even so ye also, when ye see these things coming to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all things be accomplished. Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

This section has often been misused by those who have attempted to date the Rapture or the Second Coming of the Messiah. The fig tree is often taken to mean the re-establishment of the State of Israel in 1948. Then, within a generation, that is forty years from 1948, the Second Coming must occur. This would place the Second Coming in 1988. Because the Rapture precedes the Second Coming by at least seven years, it would place the Rapture by 1981. This is simply date-setting–something the Scriptures clearly forbid. Nevertheless, date-setters continue to revise their 1981 “prophecy” year after year. Since 1988 has now come and gone, the new focus is to start the forty years with the Six-Day War in 1967. So now, some are predicting the return of the Lord around 2006-2007.

There are two errors in this type of reasoning and its exposition. First, the Bible nowhere limits the period of a generation to simply forty years. The one place where the term “generation” is given a specific length of time, it is reckoned to be one hundred years (Gen. 15:13-16). Actually, the term “generation” can mean “twenty,” ”forty,” “seventy,” “eighty,” and “one hundred” years. Sometimes it simply means “contemporaries,” much as we use the term today. That is the way it is used here. A second mistake made in this reasoning is assuming that the fig tree is a symbol of Israel and that this passage is speaking of the re-establishment of the Jewish State in 1948. This has not been mentioned anywhere in the entire Olivet Discourse. The re-establishment of Israel has merely been assumed and presupposed in the passage, but it has never been dealt with specifically . Furthermore, the usual scriptural symbol for Israel is the vine.

However, the real point of this passage is that the fig tree is being used literally as an illustration, not as a symbol for Israel. This is clearly seen from verse 29 of the Luke passage, which reads “Behold the fig tree, and all the trees.” If the fig tree represents Israel, what, then, do all the other trees represent? If they refer to other nations, and since a number of nations have risen–and keep rising–since 1948, then when would the forty-year countdown really begin? Neither the fig tree nor the other trees are used symbolically to refer to any nation or nations; rather, they are being used literally as an illustration.

The point of the illustration is this: When the fig tree, and all the other trees begin to blossom, it is a sure sign that summer is on its way, because blossoming occurs in the spring. Then, in application of the illustration, Jesus said, “Even so ye also, when ye see all these things, know ye that he is nigh, even at the doors.” Just as a blossoming fig tree means that summer is on its way, in the same way, when these events that Yeshua spoke about occur, then they can know that His return is near.

But what is it that signals the soon return of the Lord? It is not the re-establishment of Israel in 1948, because Jesus never mentioned that event in this passage. Rather, the event that He was speaking of was the Abomination of Desolation. When the Abomination of Desolation occurs, it will signal the soon return of the Messiah, namely only 3_years later. More specifically, it will be exactly 1,260 days from the Abomination of Desolation until the Second Coming.

Then Yeshua stated that the generation that sees this event–the Abomination of Desolation–will still be around when the Second Coming of the Messiah occurs 3_ years later. The point of verse 34 is not that the generation that sees the re-establishment of the Jewish State will still be here at the Second Coming, but rather, the Jewish generation that sees the Abomination of Desolation will still be here at the Second Coming. Verse 34 is intended to be a word of comfort in light of the world-wide attempt at Jewish destruction. It must be kept in mind that the Abomination of Desolation signals Satan's and the Antichrist's final attempt to exterminate the Jews. The fact that the Jewish generation will still be here when the Second Coming of the Messiah occurs shows that Satan's attempt toward Jewish destruction will fail, and the Jewish saints of the second half of the Tribulation can receive comfort from these words.

The “coming” referred to in this passage is not the Rapture, for which no signs are promised, but the Second Coming itself. This is evident from the Luke account, for he states that what the Abomination of Desolation signals is the coming of the Kingdom of God. The Millennial Kingdom will be a result of the Second Coming, not of the Rapture. Again, the point of this section is not that the fig tree represents Israel in 1948, but rather, the fig tree is being used literally as an illustration. The point of the illustration is to provide a word of comfort that the world-wide attempt to destroy the Jews is destined for failure, for the Jewish generation that sees the Abomination of Desolation will still be around when the Messiah returns.

Fat:
Great topic Intojoy.

First of all at this time the Jews do not have total control of Jerusalem. The Jews have a presence in Jerusalem, but you could hardly say that they control it.

Second of all Luke 21:24 does not give a starting time for the times of the Gentiles fulfillment.
There is one verse in the Bible which does give us a starting time an ending time. This is found in Revelations 11:2. Very clear here Christ is telling us that this time period is the first 3 1/2 years of the tribulation, and this fits right in with Luke 21.

Now we can throw in Romans 11:25 where Paul speaks of the fullness of the Gentiles, I believe this is unrelated and talking about the gospel reaching the Gentiles, but it may be worth discussing.

Intojoy:
And as he sat on the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of your coming, and of the end of the world?

The Luke account reads: And they asked him, saying, Teacher, when therefore shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when these things are about to come to pass?

Altogether, three questions were asked which, at the same time, included requests for three signs. The first question in the Matthew passage was, “Tell us, when shall these things be?” These things refer to the destruction of the Temple that He had prophesied in the previous two verses. In the Luke passage, this first question is phrased as, “Master, but when] shall these things be?” and what shall be the sign when these things are about to come to pass? In other words, the first question was: When will the Temple be destroyed, and what will be the sign that this is about to take place?

The second question was, “What shall be the sign of your coming?” This question does not concern the Rapture of the Church because the Rapture is imminent and can happen at any moment, having no warning sign preceding it. However, the Second Coming will be preceded by a sign, and the disciples asked what the sign would be.

The third question was, “What shall be the sign of the end of the world?” The Greek word translated world actually means “age.” They asked for a third sign, and that was, “What will be the sign that the end of this age has begun?” In rabbinic theology of that day, the rabbis spoke of two ages: “this age,” meaning the age in which we now live, and “the age to come,” meaning the Messianic Age. So the question is, “What is the sign that the last days of this age have begun and will lead to the Messianic Age?”

Altogether, then, there were three questions in which the disciples asked for three signs to watch for. Yeshua answered these questions, but not in the same order as they were asked. Nor are all three answers found in all three accounts. While Matthew and Mark recorded the answers to the second and third questions, they ignored the answer to the first question. It is Luke who recorded the Messiah's answer to the first question.

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