Bible Talk > Sound doctrine
The Soul and the Spirit
Alexander Winslow:
Hello Fat,
Still writing your own Bible I see!
The point of the resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous is that 'all' mankind will be given a second chance to receive everlasting life on earth as perfect humans, providing they stand against Satan when he is let loose for the last time after his incarceration during the thousand year reign of the Christ. (Revelation 20:1-10)
If as you suggest, that the unrighteous are resurrected just to be condemned; then there would be no point in their resurrection and no point of the judgement period of the Christ which is specifically designed to determine who will and who will not receive either life or death!
This was demonstrated plainly by Jesus in his parable of the wheat and the weeds, showing that just as they were all allowed to grow together until the harvest and then be separated; so all resurrected mankind will be allowed to grow together during the thousand year reign of the Christ as they are all brought up to perfection and then judged accordingly after Satan is released.
This is actually the whole point of God's will and purpose, the provision of the anointed Jesus and his sacrifice which was to cancel Adamic death and open up the way to the resurrection and the opportunity of everlasting life on earth as originally intended.
Yes, those who do follow Satan during this period and the Bible tells us that their number will be as numerous as the grains of sand on the beach; will be annihilated by the 'second' death [Gehenna] (Revelation 21:8)
as foreshadowed by the Valley of Hinnom outside Jerusalem where the incinerator fire burned continually.
Alexander
Fat:
John 5:28 "Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, 29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.
--- Quote from: Alexander Winslow on August 16, 2014, 06:13:33 pm ---If as you suggest, that the unrighteous are resurrected just to be condemned; then there would be no point in their resurrection and no point of the judgement period of the Christ which is specifically designed to determine who will and who will not receive either life or death!
--- End quote ---
What follows judgement? Is it back to the grave? Why the resurrection just to return them? However if the judgement leads to eternal fire then all of a sudden the scriptures are in harmony.
Matthew 25:46 And these shall go away into eternal punishment: but the righteous into eternal life.
The NAS New Testament Greek Lexicon
Strong's Number: 166
Original Word Word Origin
aionioß from (165)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Aionios 1:208,31
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
ahee-o'-nee-os Adjective
Definition
without beginning and end, that which always has been and always will be
without beginning
without end, never to cease, everlasting
Alexander Winslow:
Thank you for your comments Fat, unfortunately like the churches of Christendom you misunderstand the application of the word 'judgement'; you are applying it in the sense that those who have committed evil deeds are already condemned. Judgement on the other hand, is like when one goes to court and everything has to be taken into consideration.
Now in the case of the Bible, all mankind still remains dead in God's eyes due to our imperfection and therefore under the sentence of judgement since the episode in Eden. (Matthew 8:22) Those not under judgement today are those of the 'little flock' chosen by Jesus and who have been already declared righteous in God's eyes as the Apostle Paul informs us. (Romans 6:10, 11; Romans 8:15)
Therefore the resurrection to judgement informs us that as Almighty God will judge imperfect mankind by his own perfect law, because to do this we would all have to be destroyed; he has provided a period of a thousand years which is the 'last' 1,000 year day referred to by Martha in her reply to Jesus (John 11:24) during which all mankind will be resurrected both the righteous and the unrighteous and after being brought up to human perfection, Satan will once more be let loose for a short period and those who remain faithful to God will then receive everlasting life on the earth.
The punishment for disobedience is 'death', (Genesis 2:16, 17) this has never altered; so when the scriptures speak of eternal punishment it is referring to eternal death. Unlike Adolph Hitler and the third Reich, Gos is a Gos of love and therefore would never commit anyone to eternal punishment in the way you and the churches state; after all, to suffer eternal torment in this way, one would have to be 'immortal' which rather defeats the purpose!
Another point we might care to take into consideration, is that if man had an immortal soul as the churches state; then there would never have been any need for Christ because on death man would have gone somewhere else.
Yet Almighty Gos actually states: “Behold, all souls are Mine. As the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is Mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.” (Ezekiel 18:4) 21st Century King James Version (KJ21) “His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.” (Psalm 146:4) King James Version (KJV) [King James I of England 1611 A.D.] 21st Century King James Version (KJ21)
So there we are, God himself declares that there is no such thing as an immortal soul because on death, one's thoughts perish immediately!
Alexander
Fat:
--- Quote from: Alexander Winslow on August 17, 2014, 07:20:43 am ---The punishment for disobedience is 'death', (Genesis 2:16, 17) this has never altered; so when the scriptures speak of eternal punishment it is referring to eternal death. Unlike Adolph Hitler and the third Reich, Gos is a Gos of love and therefore would never commit anyone to eternal punishment in the way you and the churches state; after all, to suffer eternal torment in this way, one would have to be 'immortal' which rather defeats the purpose!
--- End quote ---
But that is not what the Scriptures say Alex DO I HAVE TO POST THEM FOR YOU?
--- Quote ---Another point we might care to take into consideration, is that if man had an immortal soul as the churches state; then there would never have been any need for Christ because on death man would have gone somewhere else.
--- End quote ---
The need for Christ is to provide a way for our sins to be covered from the sight of God. Do you know what the ScapeGoat represents? You must be without sin Alex, you honor us all with your presences.
--- Quote ---So there we are, God himself declares that there is no such thing as an immortal soul because on death, one's thoughts perish immediately!
Alexander
--- End quote ---
Sorry Alex but nothing you have posted supports you conclusion.
Alexander Winslow:
Hello Fat,
Thank you for your comments, although you clearly do not understand the Bible.
You are mixing ancient Law with Christan Truth. You remind me of those in Jesus' day who listened but failed to get the sense of what they heard.
I have already presented you with the sense behind all of this, but you are reading the scriptures without understanding and therefore reaching erroneous conclusions.
I could not put it any plainer than I have, you are reading metaphorical terms as literal which when reasoned out makes nonsense of scripture.
Please post whatever you wish and we will go through it one by one, I did this at Oxford.
Remember, what I post here has nothing to do with my own origination, it comes straight form scriptural understanding.
For instance, your comment: "The need for Christ is to provide a way for our sins to be covered from the sight of God. Do you know what the Scape Goat represents? You must be without sin Alex, you honor us all with your presences."
To begin with, the need for Christ was to provide a corresponding ransom for Adamic sin whereby without it we would all be still under the sentence of death without the hope of a resurrection. Also, although the death of Christ would have been sufficient in any way shape or form for the Gentile nations, it had to be exactly in the manner that it was to release the Jew from the 'curse' of the Mosaic Law which condemned them every day for their imperfections.
The Apostle Paul explains this in his letter to the Hebrews, showing the by his death in the same manner as the sacrifice of the lamb down in Egypt and its blood smeared on the door posts to enable the angel of death to pass over; this was a foreshadow of the execution of the Lamb of God whose blood smeared his instrument of execution thereby releasing the Jew from the curse of the Law and mankind from Adamic death. To confirm this the Apostle Paul states: "Christ our passover has now been sacrificed." (1 Corinthians 5:7)
So toady both the Jew and the Gentile are no longer under either the condemnation of the Mosaic Law nor the condemnation of Adamic death. But except for the anointed 'little flock' chosen specially by Christ, the rest of us still remain 'dead' in God's eyes. (Matthew 8:22)
You continue: "Sorry Alex but nothing you have posted supports you conclusion."
On the contrary, so far you have produced nothing scripturally to contradict what I have presented scripturally.
For instance, you state: "You must be without sin Alex, you honor us all with your presences."
Now I do not know where you have got that one from, but John states: "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us." (1 John 1:8)
So here John is informing us that while we all remain imperfect this side of Christ's thousand year reign, we will continue to remain imperfect and 'dead' in God's eyes. This is confirmed by the scripture: "The rest of the dead [mankind] did not come to life until the thousand years were ended." (Revelation 20:5)
Although we have now come under the grace of God through the ransom sacrifice of Christ Jesus, no salvation will be achieved until after the resurrection and thousand year reign of the Christ. Then at the end of this, those who prove themselves worthy will be given everlasting life on earth; while the rest of unworthy mankind will enter the 'second death' [Gehenna] Revelation 21:8
One cannot be in danger of the 'second death' until resurrected from the first death.
You have also failed to confirm what you actually believe concerning God's will and purpose for the human race.
Alexander
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version