Luke 7:18-21 King James Version (KJV)
18 And the disciples of John shewed him of all these things.
19 And John calling unto him two of his disciples sent them to Jesus, saying, Art thou he that should come? or look we for another?
20 When the men were come unto him, they said, John Baptist hath sent us unto thee, saying, Art thou he that should come? or look we for another?
21 And in that same hour he cured many of their infirmities and plagues, and of evil spirits; and unto many that were blind he gave sight.
Luke 7:18-21 Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
18 Yochanan’s talmidim informed him of all these things. Then Yochanan called two of his talmidim 19 and sent them to the Lord to ask, “Are you the one who is to come? Or should we look for someone else?” 20 When the men came to him, they said, “Yochanan the Immerser has sent us to you to ask, ‘Are you the one who is to come? Or should we keep looking — for someone else?’” 21 Right then he was healing many people of diseases, pains and evil spirits, and giving sight to many who were blind.
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB) Copyright © 1998 by David H. Stern. All rights reserved.
These are my thoughts, please share yours.
18 These men were followers of John but they went to Jesus, people following something or someone else doesn’t change that Jesus is the one with authority.
19 John boldly proclaimed Jesus before but now because of him being arrested he doubted, we may doubt during the hard times but we can go to the Lord and be reassured.
20 So they went and asked the question on John’s behalf. Jesus thankful is the one who stands on our behalf before the Lord.
21 Jesus had already as this point healed more people then anyone else ever would. Jesus at this point already had done things that hadn’t been done before. He is still the same today.
First of all, what did the disciples of John the Baptist reported to him...?Then why did Jesus send them back to john with the quotes from Isaiah 35:5, 6 ?
That which happened from chapter 7:11-17..
Therefore, how can John the Baptist doubt hearing all these good works and among others, JESUS is doing and is well spoken about, even here in all Judea..?
And when prior to this, John the baptist did exalt JESUS to his disciples and preached to them about Him...? (John3:22-36)
Therefore to the Scripture accounts you have posted, John the Baptist sends two of his disciples as witnesses and with a question, to JESUS, because he 'doubted'....?
John the Baptist know his time is up, as do all true spiritual man of GOD. The concern here is his disciples who are still with him, when they are supposed to be with their MESSIAH JESUS in believe and faith, and follow Him, and not with him any longer. Many times openly and closely John the Baptist did minister, even firsthand to is disciple, about who CHRIST is and what did He come for. And moreover how significant and important is JESUS was compared to him.
i believe John the Baptist created this incident for his disciples to see and believe, and have faith in JESUS, after he is gone. And sure enough, after he was beheaded, his disciple went to JESUS and reported about his death.
Then why did Jesus send them back to john with the quotes from Isaiah 35:5, 6 ?
Why did not John just tell his disciples Jesus was the Christ and it was time for them to go follow Him?
And why only two of his disciples?
And He answered and said to them, "Go and report to John what you have seen and heard: the BLIND RECEIVE SIGHT, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, the POOR HAVE THE GOSPEL PREACHED TO THEM. (Luke 7:22, NASB)
According to the Law of Moses, they need only two or three witnesses, in order to justify a case...
And who were they to make that case to? Answer: John the Baptist
John gave us a hint on what he believed the Messiah was here to do in Matthew 3. He believed that the Messiah was here to bring righteous judgment unto the people of Israel.
Matt 3:12. "His winnowing fork is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clear His threshing floor; and He will gather His wheat into the barn, but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."
But this was not what was being reported to him by his disciples. (Luk 7:18.)
So yes John was confused, even so was the confusion of the people of Israel. Fortunately the simple quotation from Isaiah was all that John needed, unfortunately Israel needed much more.
fredjames
I was feeling a good debate coming on looked interesting. However after reading your last two lines I feel we have nothing to discuss with each other.
Shalom
B.B.
And John the Baptist was not himself, for he had the spirit of Elijah in him. For Elijah and Moses knew everything about JESUS, the LORD from Heaven, and both came down from there, ones who visited JESUS during His 'transfiguration', witnessed by disciple John, Peter and James themselves, as in order to comfort JESUS…
Because moreover from what i have been given to testify prior, as to verify John's innocence based on the written truth, that he having the spirit of Elijah, is 'spiritually discerned' about the MESSIAH and proclaiming to Israel that day in contradiction to them, even Herod and the leaders of Israel, and not 'carnally discerned' acting likewise with them.
Apparently you believe it is far better to receive the spirit of Elijah than to receive the Holy Spirit.
Making the claim that a man knows everything about God is a little bit on the fringe.
When Elizabeth was carrying John the Baptist and was visited by Mary, Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit not of the great spirit of Elijah.
We agree on one thing John's mission had come to an end and it was not ending as he thought it would. You believe that John the Baptist could never have the slightest, tiniest thought that he may have made a mistake? If that is so he is probably the only character of any of the prophets who did not at some time falter. May I remind you that he was a man and he was a sinner and it was only the man John, and not the prophet, who made the inquiry. Do you disagree with that that John the Baptist was a sinner?
John 1:
29. The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
30. "This is He on behalf of whom I said, 'After me comes a Man who has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.'
31. "I did not recognize Him, but so that He might be manifested to Israel, I came baptizing in water."
32. John testified saying, "I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and He remained upon Him.
33. "I did not recognize Him, but He who sent me to baptize in water said to me, 'He upon whom you see the Spirit descending and remaining upon Him, this is the One who baptizes in the Holy Spirit.'
34. "I myself have seen, and have testified that this is the Son of God."
35. Again the next day John was standing with two of his disciples,
36. and he looked at Jesus as He walked, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God!"
37. The two disciples heard him speak, and they followed Jesus.
38. And Jesus turned and saw them following, and said to them, "What do you seek?" They said to Him, "Rabbi (which translated means Teacher), where are You staying?"
39. He said to them, "Come, and you will see." So they came and saw where He was staying; and they stayed with Him that day, for it was about the tenth hour.
40. One of the two who heard John [speak] and followed Him, was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother.
This trash you post cannot be left unanswered and this is the only reason I'm responding to you. We learned early in the Bible that Satan uses half-truths to promote his lie.
John 1:
29. The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
30. "This is He on behalf of whom I said, 'After me comes a Man who has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.'
31. "I did not recognize Him, but so that He might be manifested to Israel, I came baptizing in water."
32. John testified saying, "I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and He remained upon Him.
33. "I did not recognize Him, but He who sent me to baptize in water said to me, 'He upon whom you see the Spirit descending and remaining upon Him, this is the One who baptizes in the Holy Spirit.'
34. "I myself have seen, and have testified that this is the Son of God."
35. Again the next day John was standing with two of his disciples,
36. and he looked at Jesus as He walked, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God!"
37. The two disciples heard him speak, and they followed Jesus.
38. And Jesus turned and saw them following, and said to them, "What do you seek?" They said to Him, "Rabbi (which translated means Teacher), where are You staying?"
39. He said to them, "Come, and you will see." So they came and saw where He was staying; and they stayed with Him that day, for it was about the tenth hour.
40. One of the two who heard John [speak] and followed Him, was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother.
This trash you post cannot be left unanswered and this is the only reason I'm responding to you. We learned early in the Bible that Satan uses half-truths to promote his lie.
John 1:
29. The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
30. "This is He on behalf of whom I said, 'After me comes a Man who has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.'
31. "I did not recognize Him, but so that He might be manifested to Israel, I came baptizing in water."
32. John testified saying, "I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and He remained upon Him.
33. "I did not recognize Him, but He who sent me to baptize in water said to me, 'He upon whom you see the Spirit descending and remaining upon Him, this is the One who baptizes in the Holy Spirit.'
34. "I myself have seen, and have testified that this is the Son of God."
35. Again the next day John was standing with two of his disciples,
36. and he looked at Jesus as He walked, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God!"
37. The two disciples heard him speak, and they followed Jesus.
38. And Jesus turned and saw them following, and said to them, "What do you seek?" They said to Him, "Rabbi (which translated means Teacher), where are You staying?"
39. He said to them, "Come, and you will see." So they came and saw where He was staying; and they stayed with Him that day, for it was about the tenth hour.
40. One of the two who heard John [speak] and followed Him, was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother.
This trash you post cannot be left unanswered and this is the only reason I'm responding to you. We learned early in the Bible that Satan uses half-truths to promote his lie.
You seem to have a little trouble with this question, but I’m going to ask again, was John the Baptist a sinner?
Now, you have found something else to go on about, when you can't stick to the topic of our discussion, as you call it debate...
So what if you on your own preception and opinion want to define John as a sinner, when you ignore the things JESUS said to the crowd about John the Baptist.
Basically, our lives with CHRIST are not 'least' to standards lower that John the Baptist's life, as we may claim to be born again and from above. For one example, we sleep on beds and have a room or even home, or in other words, provided home cooked meals, even in restaurants. But John the Baptist chose and had the dirt and cave to live in, and only locusts and wild honey was his diet...
So, get a grip of your pride, and being wise in your own conceit, for our words in ignorance used, whether against the 'patriarch' of Israel, or even John the Baptist sent by GOD, will be used on judgement day to judge us.
Matthew 16
17. And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal [this] to you, but My Father who is in heaven.
18. "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it.
19. "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."
23 But He turned and said to Peter, “Get behind Me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to Me; for you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but man’s.”
"As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
But John tried to prevent Him, saying, "I have need to be baptized by You, and do You come to me?" But Jesus answering said to him, "Permit it at this time; for in this way it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he permitted Him.”
Matthew 3
And John the Baptist was not himself, for he had the spirit of Elijah in him. For Elijah and Moses knew everything about JESUS,
Luke 1
13 But the angel said to him: “Do not be afraid, Zechariah; your prayer has been heard. Your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you are to call him John. 14 He will be a joy and delight to you, and many will rejoice because of his birth, 15 for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even before he is born. 16 He will bring back many of the people of Israel to the Lord their God. 17 And he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the parents to their children and the disobedient to the wisdom of the righteous—to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”
Your premise here from what I understand, is that John the Baptist could never have had any doubt because John was upstanding faithful man who would never allow Satan to influence any of his actions. If I am wrong in this please correct me. I ask you a basic question if John the Baptist was a sinner and you responded tell me that John the Baptist was a better man than you and I, which I do not disagree with. But was John the Baptist a sinner?
John the Baptist made the same mistake as Peter did in Matthew 16. Remember when Jesus praised him because he had received revelations from God in heaven? Then just a few verses down Jesus accused him of being a stumbling block and being used by Satan.
Now I want to present to you a problem that occurred at the time Christ was baptized by John the Baptist. John the Baptist had prophesied that Christ would not baptized by water but by the Holy Spirit and fire.
But then what did John do when Christ came to be baptized by him? What he did was almost the same thing as Peter did, he tried to interfere and have Christ do something that was just prophesied by John that He would not do. If Christ would've done what John asked Him to do people could've pointed at Him and say that is not the Christ according to John's prophecy.
It appears that is very possible that John the Baptist after his ministry was finished, had some doubt of what he was seeing because he had believed like the other Jews, that the Christ was there to bring righteous judgment unto the people of Israel. This is why Jesus quotes Isaiah 35:5, 6