Author Topic: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?  (Read 4811 times)

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kjw47

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2015, 02:05:00 PM »
Please excuse the cut n paste to address John 1 but my time is short.
But the real major problem you have in trying to understand the Trinity, is the weakness and restrictions you place on God the Father. The God that is worship by Christians is capable of being in a burning bush and at the same time being in his kingdom. God Father is also capable of eating dinner with Abraham and discussing the coming doom of Sodom, all the while setting on His throne in His kingdom. God that I worship Loves me so much that He took the form of the man and lowered Himself lower than the angels and hung himself on a tree so that I may receive eternal life.
 Apparently your god sent a created being, much like a unblemished lamb, to be sacrificed so that you may work your way to heaven.

My God is the Almighty Jehovah capable of all things's and we are incapable of knowing His full power, and I place no restriction on Him.

Sorry to but in but I could not watch this anymore.


Men saw Jesus--No one has ever seen God. Jesus spoke to God in heaven while on earth--Rev 1:1--God gave the revelation to Jesus-proving they are separate. Paul was clear at 1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all-the Father.  John 4:22-24--one better be doing this daily.

kjw47

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2015, 02:11:18 PM »

That's OK I was going another direction anyway:

"This 'prophet' was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah's Christian witnesses . . . Of course, it is easy to say that this group acts as a 'prophet' of God. It is another thing to prove it" (The Watchtower, April 1, 1972, p. 197).



If the Watchtower Organization is a prophet of God, why has it made false prophecies?
1897 "Our Lord, the appointed King, is now present, since October 1874" (Studies in the Scriptures, Vol. 4, p. 621).
1899 " . . . the battle of the great day of God Almighty' (Revelation 16:14), which will end in A.D. 1914 with the complete overthrow of earth's present rulership, is already commenced" (The Time Is at Hand, 1908 ed., p. 101).
1918 "Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the faithful prophets of old, particularly those named by the Apostle in Hebrews 11, to the condition of human perfection" (Millions Now Living Will Never Die, p. 89).
1922 "The date 1925 is even more distinctly indicated by the Scriptures than 1914" (The Watchtower, Sept. 1, 1922, p. 262).
1923 "Our thought is, that 1925 is definitely settled by the Scriptures. As to Noah, the Christian now has much more upon which to base his faith than Noah had upon which to base his faith in a coming deluge" (The Watchtower, April 1, 1923, p. 106).
1925 "The year 1925 is here. With great expectation Christians have looked forward to this year. Many have confidently expected that all members of the body of Christ will be changed to heavenly glory during this year. This may be accomplished. It may not be. In his own due time God will accomplish his purposes concerning his people. Christians should not be so deeply concerned about what may transpire this year" (The Watchtower, January 1, 1925, p. 3).
1931 "There was a measure of disappointment on the part of Jehovah's faithful ones on earth concerning the years 1917, 1918, and 1925, which disappointment lasted for a time . . . and they also learned to quit fixing dates" (Vindication, p. 338).
1941 "Receiving the gift, the marching children clasped it to them, not a toy or plaything for idle pleasure, but the Lord's provided instrument for most effective work in the remaining months before Armageddon" (The Watchtower, Sept. 15, 1941, p. 288).
1968 "True, there have been those in times past who predicted an end to the world, even announcing a specific date. Yet nothing happened. The end did not come. They were guilty of false prophesying. Why? What was missing?.. Missing from such people were God's truths and evidence that he was using and guiding them" (Awake, Oct. 8, 1968).
1968 "Why are you looking forward to 1975?" (The Watchtower, Aug. 15, 1968, p. 494).


All the men who said those things are dead and paid the wages of sin-- and they are not prophets. They did err by trying to put a date on a real prophecy made by God not by men--Har-mageddon was promised by God--a real prophecy, alls they did was put a date on it, they did not make up a prophecy on their own. they have repented of it.
I will face judgement any day of the week with men who made errors with words rather than with men who allowed their supposed brothers in Christ to kill each other--millions upon millions in the rev war, the civil war,ww1,ww2--they even killed for Hitler trinity young men vs trinity young men--while the teachers prahyed tyop the same god on both sides( one of the biggest hi[pocrosys of all time witnessed by all of creation) the bloodguilt has amassed to the heavens. all for a non existent trinity god.

Fat

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2015, 02:58:18 PM »

All the men who said those things are dead and paid the wages of sin-- and they are not prophets. They did err by trying to put a date on a real prophecy made by God not by men--Har-mageddon was promised by God--a real prophecy, alls they did was put a date on it, they did not make up a prophecy on their own. they have repented of it.
I will face judgement any day of the week with men who made errors with words rather than with men who allowed their supposed brothers in Christ to kill each other--millions upon millions in the rev war, the civil war,ww1,ww2--they even killed for Hitler trinity young men vs trinity young men--while the teachers prahyed tyop the same god on both sides( one of the biggest hi[pocrosys of all time witnessed by all of creation) the bloodguilt has amassed to the heavens. all for a non existent trinity god.

The men who said those things, also translated your Bible.

kjw47

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2015, 04:22:21 AM »
The men who said those things, also translated your Bible.


The NWT is in harmony where as trinity translations are not---  only 1 of them may have translated the NWT--the first didn't come out until the 1950,s


John 20:17, Rev 3:12--- the best advice on earth= believe Jesus

Fat

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2015, 07:36:07 AM »

The NWT is in harmony where as trinity translations are not---  only 1 of them may have translated the NWT--the first didn't come out until the 1950,s


John 20:17, Rev 3:12--- the best advice on earth= believe Jesus

Actuality the NWT is not in harmony even with it's self.
http://biblediscussion.org/index.php/topic,219.msg1673.html?PHPSESSID=b9074b36365ca91caf3b61b3f39bd633#msg1673

The NWT has no unblemished lamb for redemption. Luke 18:18-19

Even worst then the translation is the Watchtowers hold on it's followers (yes followers of the WT organization, not followers of Christ) they make hundreds of excuses for the inconsistency of their mistakes in their NWT.

If you don't believe in the Trinity Godhead who do you teach is the father of Jesus? Matthew 1:20

kjw47

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #20 on: March 03, 2015, 12:42:03 PM »
Actuality the NWT is not in harmony even with it's self.
http://biblediscussion.org/index.php/topic,219.msg1673.html?PHPSESSID=b9074b36365ca91caf3b61b3f39bd633#msg1673

The NWT has no unblemished lamb for redemption. Luke 18:18-19

Even worst then the translation is the Watchtowers hold on it's followers (yes followers of the WT organization, not followers of Christ) they make hundreds of excuses for the inconsistency of their mistakes in their NWT.

If you don't believe in the Trinity Godhead who do you teach is the father of Jesus? Matthew 1:20


The Father of Jesus is his God--John 20:17, Rev 3:12--- one has to believe Jesus over mens dogmas. YHWH(Jehovah) a single being mono God served by every Israelite from Moses on up--fact of Israelite history. That is why Jesus was taught everything, given everything, and God shared glory with him. Gods master worker.

Fat

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #21 on: March 03, 2015, 06:26:42 PM »

The Father of Jesus is his God--John 20:17, Rev 3:12--- one has to believe Jesus over mens dogmas. YHWH(Jehovah) a single being mono God served by every Israelite from Moses on up--fact of Israelite history. That is why Jesus was taught everything, given everything, and God shared glory with him. Gods master worker.

The Jehovah's Witnesses have a savior or do they have two saviors?
 As most people know the Jehovah's witnesses have rewritten the Bible for the sole purpose of separating Christ and God the Father. They still do not explain how they can have two saviors when in Isaiah 43:10-11 their own translation says, "YOU are my witnesses,” is the utterance of Jehovah, “even my servant whom I have chosen, in order that YOU may know and have faith in me, and that YOU may understand that I am the same One. Before me there was no God formed, and after me there continued to be none. I—I am Jehovah, and besides me there is no savior.”

 In many verses in their translation of the Bible such as acts 13:23 they refer to the Savior of Israel as Jesus. It is repeated again and acts 5:31 God exalted this one as Chief Agent and Savior to his right hand, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins. And in 2 Timothy 1:10 they refer to the Savior as Jesus Christ. There are many more verses in the Bible such as first John 4:14, Titus 2:6-14, acts 4:9-12 Titus 1:1-16, 2 Timothy 1:10. Sometimes when the Savior is being referred to as Christ is in lower case and sometimes it is capitalized apparently for no rhyme or reason. It appears they've concentrated so hard on trying to divide the Father and the Son that they forgot that only one, according to the Father can be the savior of Israel.

1 John 4: (NWT)
14 In addition, we ourselves have beheld and are bearing witness that the Father has sent forth his Son as Savior of the world.

Titus 2: (NWT)
6 Likewise keep on exhorting the younger men to be sound in mind, 7 in all things showing yourself an example of fine works; showing uncorruptness in your teaching, seriousness, 8 wholesome speech which cannot be condemned; so that the man on the opposing side may get ashamed, having nothing vile to say about us. 9 Let slaves be in subjection to their owners in all things, and please them well, not talking back, 10 not committing theft, but exhibiting good fidelity to the full, so that they may adorn the teaching of our Savior, God, in all things.

Acts 4 (NWT)
9 if we are this day being examined, on the basis of a good deed to an ailing man, as to by whom this man has been made well, 10 let it be known to all of YOU and to all the people of Israel, that in the name of Jesus Christ the Naz·a·rene´, whom YOU impaled but whom God raised up from the dead, by this one does this man stand here sound in front of YOU. 11 This is ‘the stone that was treated by YOU builders as of no account that has become the head of the corner.’ 12 Furthermore, there is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved.”

kjw47

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #22 on: March 06, 2015, 03:12:55 PM »
The Jehovah's Witnesses have a savior or do they have two saviors?
 As most people know the Jehovah's witnesses have rewritten the Bible for the sole purpose of separating Christ and God the Father. They still do not explain how they can have two saviors when in Isaiah 43:10-11 their own translation says, "YOU are my witnesses,” is the utterance of Jehovah, “even my servant whom I have chosen, in order that YOU may know and have faith in me, and that YOU may understand that I am the same One. Before me there was no God formed, and after me there continued to be none. I—I am Jehovah, and besides me there is no savior.”

 In many verses in their translation of the Bible such as acts 13:23 they refer to the Savior of Israel as Jesus. It is repeated again and acts 5:31 God exalted this one as Chief Agent and Savior to his right hand, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins. And in 2 Timothy 1:10 they refer to the Savior as Jesus Christ. There are many more verses in the Bible such as first John 4:14, Titus 2:6-14, acts 4:9-12 Titus 1:1-16, 2 Timothy 1:10. Sometimes when the Savior is being referred to as Christ is in lower case and sometimes it is capitalized apparently for no rhyme or reason. It appears they've concentrated so hard on trying to divide the Father and the Son that they forgot that only one, according to the Father can be the savior of Israel.

1 John 4: (NWT)
14 In addition, we ourselves have beheld and are bearing witness that the Father has sent forth his Son as Savior of the world.

Titus 2: (NWT)
6 Likewise keep on exhorting the younger men to be sound in mind, 7 in all things showing yourself an example of fine works; showing uncorruptness in your teaching, seriousness, 8 wholesome speech which cannot be condemned; so that the man on the opposing side may get ashamed, having nothing vile to say about us. 9 Let slaves be in subjection to their owners in all things, and please them well, not talking back, 10 not committing theft, but exhibiting good fidelity to the full, so that they may adorn the teaching of our Savior, God, in all things.

Acts 4 (NWT)
9 if we are this day being examined, on the basis of a good deed to an ailing man, as to by whom this man has been made well, 10 let it be known to all of YOU and to all the people of Israel, that in the name of Jesus Christ the Naz·a·rene´, whom YOU impaled but whom God raised up from the dead, by this one does this man stand here sound in front of YOU. 11 This is ‘the stone that was treated by YOU builders as of no account that has become the head of the corner.’ 12 Furthermore, there is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved.”


Real context---it is Jehovah God who does it all, he is the only power--he does it through Jesus,( Acts 2:22) his master worker( Proverbs 8-1Cor 1:30)--that is why both are referred to as many things. Jehovah shares the honor and glory with Jesus. Those who believe Jesus knows he taught--I can do 0 of my own inititive--and last line of The Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.--he shares with Jesus.
Yes, one gets saved by the real Jesus.

see at 1John 4:14--The Father sent Jesus--at John 17:1-6,26---Jesus teaches--the one who sent him is THE ONLY TRUE GOD-- verse 6=Jehovah, 26= Jehovah-----  believe Jesus. that is how one gets saved--they listen to the Father who spoke from heaven at Jesus baptism---This is my son, the beloved in whom I am well pleased--LISTEN TO HIM. So when Jesus clearly teaches the Father is the only true God--they listen to him over schooled mens dogmas out of erred translations. Paul listened-1Cor 8:6) And Jesus taught--proof of ones love for him was by listening to him--this means--learning every truth he taught and applying every truth he taught. That is the will of God.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2015, 03:15:48 PM by kjw47 »

Fat

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Re: Do Jehovah's Witnesses claim they will judge Christ?
« Reply #23 on: March 06, 2015, 05:24:22 PM »

Real context---it is Jehovah God who does it all, he is the only power--he does it through Jesus,( Acts 2:22) his master worker( Proverbs 8-1Cor 1:30)--that is why both are referred to as many things. Jehovah shares the honor and glory with Jesus. Those who believe Jesus knows he taught--I can do 0 of my own inititive--and last line of The Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.--he shares with Jesus.
Yes, one gets saved by the real Jesus.

see at 1John 4:14--The Father sent Jesus--at John 17:1-6,26---Jesus teaches--the one who sent him is THE ONLY TRUE GOD-- verse 6=Jehovah, 26= Jehovah-----  believe Jesus. that is how one gets saved--they listen to the Father who spoke from heaven at Jesus baptism---This is my son, the beloved in whom I am well pleased--LISTEN TO HIM. So when Jesus clearly teaches the Father is the only true God--they listen to him over schooled mens dogmas out of erred translations. Paul listened-1Cor 8:6) And Jesus taught--proof of ones love for him was by listening to him--this means--learning every truth he taught and applying every truth he taught. That is the will of God.

Yes indeed in context:

Isaiah 43 (NWT)
10  “You are my witnesses,” declares Jehovah,
“Yes, my servant whom I have chosen,
So that you may know and have faith in me
And understand that I am the same One.
Before me no God was formed,
And after me there has been none.

11  I—I am Jehovah, and besides me there is no savior.”
12  “I am the One who declared and saved and made known
When there was no foreign god among you.
So you are my witnesses,” declares Jehovah, “and I am God.
13  Also, I am always the same One;
And no one can snatch anything out of my hand.
When I act, who can prevent it?”


Oh no we have a conflict:

Quote
1 John 4: (NWT)
14 In addition, we ourselves have beheld and are bearing witness that the Father has sent forth his Son as Savior of the world.

Titus 2: (NWT)
6 Likewise keep on exhorting the younger men to be sound in mind, 7 in all things showing yourself an example of fine works; showing uncorruptness in your teaching, seriousness, 8 wholesome speech which cannot be condemned; so that the man on the opposing side may get ashamed, having nothing vile to say about us. 9 Let slaves be in subjection to their owners in all things, and please them well, not talking back, 10 not committing theft, but exhibiting good fidelity to the full, so that they may adorn the teaching of our Savior, God, in all things.

Acts 4 (NWT)
9 if we are this day being examined, on the basis of a good deed to an ailing man, as to by whom this man has been made well, 10 let it be known to all of YOU and to all the people of Israel, that in the name of Jesus Christ the Naz·a·rene´, whom YOU impaled but whom God raised up from the dead, by this one does this man stand here sound in front of YOU. 11 This is ‘the stone that was treated by YOU builders as of no account that has become the head of the corner.’ 12 Furthermore, there is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved.”

Oh gee I forgot:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.  (NWT)