Author Topic: Jesus Christ, Preexistent John 1:1-18  (Read 1936 times)

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JB Horn

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Jesus Christ, Preexistent John 1:1-18
« on: October 30, 2012, 10:30:38 pm »

From the DISCIPLE’S STUDY BIBLE

John 1:1-18
Jesus Christ, Preexistent—John’s account of Jesus’ beginnings is an absolute account that stretches back beyond time and into eternity. John contributed an essential understanding to the Gospels’ composite picture of Jesus. He affirmed that God’s Messiah was in the beginning. “In the beginning” is different from “from the beginning.” In the beginning speaks of eternity. From the beginning means as far back as humans have had any experience (8:44). Jesus is identified with the Creator rather than the created. He shares the divine attribute of eternal existence. John’s Gospel reveals: (1) Messiah has always been with God; (2) Messiah is called the Word of God; (3) Messiah is God’s agent of creation; (4) Messiah is light in contrast to darkness; (5) Messiah is witnessed to by John the Baptist; (6) Messiah is not known by His own; (7) Messiah is the only begotten of the Father—a distinct and exclusively Johannine expression which means unique, one of a kind; (8 ) Messiah is superior to the authority of Judaism; and (9) Messiah is the only one who has seen God face to face. The actual account of Messiah’s birth is in v. 14. The term for “made flesh” in Latin is incarnatus , from which we derive the word “incarnation.” We mean by this term that God entered our history through Jesus Christ in actual human form. We dare not miss the light of Jesus’ humanity (v. 14) among the deep theological expressions about His unique relationship to God. V. 9 may mean that Jesus gives some light to every person who comes into the world, or it may mean that His coming into the world illumines what we really are. Jesus is not only what God is like; He is also what humanity was intended to be. In this sense, we shall be like Him (1 Jn 3:2 ). That is, we shall become really and fully human in Him and completely so in eternity. John’s Christmas story is a vivid visual in black and white, in darkness and light.

Fat

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Re: Jesus Christ, Preexistent John 1:1-18
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2012, 02:05:01 pm »
I would guess the JW's would argue that the beginning in John 1 is the beginning of the earth.

Moss

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Re: Jesus Christ, Preexistent John 1:1-18
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2012, 11:20:09 am »
I found three other commentary's that you may find interesting.


Based on the classic commentary of
Jamieson, Fausset, and Brown
Quote
1 In the beginning—the beginning before all beginnings, prior to the beginning of Genesis 1:1 . The phrase could be rendered “from all eternity.” The expression in Greek “characterizes Christ as preexistent, thus defining the nature of his person” (Dana and Mantey). was the Word—Greek, ho logos , signifying primarily “the Expression”—God expressed, God explained, God defined (see 1:18 ). The Greek term logos in philosophical terminology also denoted the principle of the universe, even the creative energy that generated the universe (Morris). Thus, Christ as the Logos is the agent of and the personal expression of the Creator God. the Word was with God—The preposition translated “with” is pros . In Koine Greek pros (short for prosōpon pros prosōpon , “face to face”) was used to show intimacy in personal relationships (see Matt. 13:56 ; 26:18 ; Mark 6:3 ; 14:49 ; 1 Cor. 13:12 ; 6:10 ; 2 Cor. 5:8 ; Gal. 1:18 ). Thus, for John to say “the Word was with God” was for him to mean “the Word was face to face with God” (see Williams’s translation) or “the Word was having intimate fellowship with God.” This speaks of the preincarnate Son’s relationship with the Father prior to creation—in fact, prior to everything (see 1:18 ; 17:5 , 24 ). the Word was God—The Greek clause underlying this clause stipulates, according to a rule of grammar, that “the Word” is the subject and “God” is the predicate nominative. Another particularity of the Greek is that the article is often used for defining individual identity and often absent in ascribing quality or character. In the previous clause (“the Word was with God”), there is an article before “God” ( ton theon ), thus pointing to God the Father; in this clause, there is no article before “God.” The distinction, though a fine one, seems to be intended. In the previous clause, John indicates that the Son was with God, the Father; in this clause, John indicates that the Son was himself God (or should we say, deity) but not the God (i.e., God the Father). Therefore, some translators have attempted to bring out these distinctions by rendering the last clause as follows: “and what God was the Word was” (NEB) or “and he was the same as God” (TEV). Thus, we see that John presents the Word as being eternal, as being with God (the Father), and as being himself God (or, deity). This is the One who became flesh and dwelt among men on earth.



Adam Clarke’s Commentary on the New Testament

Quote
John 1:1
In the beginning—That is, before any thing was formed—ere God began the great work of creation. This is the meaning of the word in Genesis 1:1 , to which the evangelist evidently alludes. This phrase fully proves, in the mouth of an inspired writer, that Jesus Christ was no part of the creation, as he existed when no part of that existed; and that consequently he is no creature, as all created nature was formed by him: for without him was nothing made that is made, John 1:3 . Now, as what was before creation must be eternal, and as what gave being to all things, could not have borrowed or derived its being from any thing, therefore Jesus, who was before all things and who made all things, must necessarily be the Eternal God.
Was the Word—Or, existed the Logos. This term should be left untranslated, for the very same reason why the names Jesus and Christ are left untranslated. The first I consider as proper an apellative of the Savior of the world as I do either of the two last. And as it would be highly improper to say, the Deliverer, the Anointed, instead of Jesus Christ, so I deem it improper to say, the Word, instead of the Logos. But as every appellative of the Savior of the world was descriptive of some excellence in his person, nature, or work, so the epithet Λογος , Logos, which signifies a word spoken, speech, eloquence, doctrine, reason, or the faculty of reasoning, is very properly applied to him, who is the true light which lighteth every man who cometh into the world, John 1:9 ; who is the fountain of all wisdom; who giveth being, life, light, knowledge, and reason, to all men; who is the grand Source of revelation, who has declared God unto mankind; who spake by the prophets, for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy, Revelation 19:10 ; who has illustrated life and immortality by his Gospel, 2 Timothy 1:10 ; and who has fully made manifest the deep mysteries which lay hidden in the bosom of the invisible God from all eternity, John 1:18 .
The apostle does not borrow this mode of speech from the writings of Plato, as some have imagined: he took it from the Scriptures of the Old Testament, and from the subsequent style of the ancient Jews. It is true the Platonists make mention of the Logos in this way:— καθ ’ ὁν, αει οντα, τα γενομενα εγενετο —by whom, eternally existing, all things were made. But as Plato, Pythagoras, Zeno, and others, traveled among the Jews, and conversed with them, it is reasonable to suppose that they borrowed this, with many others of their most important notions and doctrines, from them.
And the Word was God—Or, God was the Logos: therefore no subordinate being, no second to the Most High, but the supreme eternal Jehovah.


Barnes’ Notes on the New Testament

Quote
John 1:1
In the beginning—This expression is used also in Gen. 1:1 . John evidently has allusion here to that place, and he means to apply to “the Word” an expression which is there applied “to God.” In both places it clearly means before creation, before the world was made, when as yet there was nothing. The meaning is: that the “Word” had an existence before the world was created. This is not spoken of the man Jesus, but of that which “became” a man, or was incarnate, John 1:14 . The Hebrews, by expressions like this, commonly denoted eternity. Thus. the eternity of God is described Ps. 90:2 : “Before the mountains were brought forth, etc.;” and eternity is commonly expressed by the phrase, before the foundation of the world.” Whatever is meant by the term “Word,” it is clear that it had an existence before “creation.” It is not, then, a “creature” or created being, and must be, therefore, uncreated and eternal. There is only one Being that is uncreated, and Jesus must be therefore divine. Compare the Saviour’s own declarations respecting himself in the following places: John 8:58 ; 17:5 ; 6:62 ; 3:13 ; 6:46 ; 8:14 ; 16:28 .
Was the Word—Greek, “was the λόγος Logos .” This name is given to him who afterward became “flesh,” or was incarnate (John 1:14 —that is, to the Messiah. Whatever is meant by it, therefore, is applicable to the Lord Jesus Christ. There have been many opinions about the reason why this name was given to the Son of God. It is unnecessary to repeat those opinions. The opinion which seems most plausible may be expressed as follows:
1. A “word” is that by which we communicate our will; by which we convey our thoughts; or by which we issue commands the medium of communication with others.
2. The Son of God may be called “the Word,” because he is the medium by which God promulgates His will and issues His commandments. See Heb. 1:1-3 .
3. This term was in use before the time of John.
(a) It was used in the Aramaic translation of the Old Testament, as, “e. g.,” Isa. 45:12 : “I have made the earth, and created man upon it.” In the Aramaic it is, “I, ‘by my word,’ have made,” etc. Isa. 48:13 : “mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth.” In the Aramaic, “‘By my word’ I have founded the earth.” And so in many other places.
(b) This term was used by the Jews as applicable to the Messiah. In their writings he was commonly known by the term “Mimra”—that is, “Word;” and no small part of the interpositions of God in defense of the Jewish nation were declared to be by “the Word of God.” Thus, in their Targum on Deut. 26:17-18 , it is said, “Ye have appointed the word of God a king over you this day, that he may be your God.”
(c) The term was used by the Jews who were scattered among the Gentiles, and especially those who were conversant with the Greek philosophy.
(d) The term was used by the followers of Plato among the Greeks, to denote the Second Person of the Trinity. The Greek term νοῦς nous or “mind,” was commonly given to this second person, but it was said that this nous was “the word” or “reason” of the First Person of the Trinity. The term was therefore extensively in use among the Jews and Gentiles before John wrote his Gospel, and it was certain that it would be applied to the Second Person of the Trinity by Christians. whether converted from Judaism or Paganism. It was important, therefore, that the meaning of the term should be settled by an inspired man, and accordingly John, in the commencement of his Gospel, is at much pains to state clearly what is the true doctrine respecting the λόγος Logos , or Word. It is possible, also, that the doctrines of the Gnostics had begun to spread in the time of John. They were an Oriental sect, and held that the λόγος Logos or “Word” was one of the “Aeones” that had been created, and that this one had been united to the man Jesus. If that doctrine had begun then to prevail, it was of the more importance for John to settle the truth in regard to the rank of the Logos or Word. This he has done in such a way that there need be no doubt about its meaning.
Was with God—This expression denotes friendship or intimacy. Compare Mark 9:19 . John affirms that he was “with God” in the beginning—that is, before the world was made. It implies, therefore, that he was partaker of the divine glory; that he was blessed and happy with God. It proves that he was intimately united with the Father, so as to partake of his glory and to be appropriately called by the name God. He has himself explained it. See John 17:5 : “And now, O Father, glorify thou we with thine own self, with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.” See also John 1:18 : “No man hath seen God at any time; the only-begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.” See also John 3:13 : “The Son of man, which is in heaven.” Compare Phil 2:6-7 .
Was God—In the previous phrase John had said that the Word was “with God.” Lest it should be supposed that he was a different and inferior being, here John states that “he was God.” There is no more unequivocal declaration in the Bible than this, and there could be no stronger proof that the sacred writer meant to affirm that the Son of God was equal with the Father; because:
1. There is no doubt that by the λόγος Logos is meant Jesus Christ.
2. This is not an “attribute” or quality of God, but is a real subsistence, for it is said that the λόγος Logos was made flesh σάρξ sarx —that is, became a human being.
3. There is no variation here in the manuscripts, and critics have observed that the Greek will bear no other construction than what is expressed in our translation—that the Word “was God.”
4. There is no evidence that John intended to use the word “God” in an inferior sense. It is not “the Word was a god,” or “the Word was ‘like God,’” but the Word “was God.” He had just used the word “God” as evidently applicable to Yahweh, the true God; and it is absurd to suppose that he would in the same verse, and without any indication that he was using the word in an inferior sense, employ it to denote a being altogether inferior to the true God.
5. The name “God” is elsewhere given to him, showing that he is the supreme God. See Rom. 9:5 ; Heb. 1:8 , 10 , 12 ; 1 John 5:20 ; John 20:28 .
The meaning of this important verse may then be thus summed up:
1. The name λόγος Logos , or Word, is given to Christ in reference to his becoming the Teacher or Instructor of mankind; the medium of communication between God and man.
2. The name was in use at the time of John, and it was his design to state the correct doctrine respecting the λόγος Logos .
3. The “Word,” or λόγος Logos , existed “before creation”—of course was not a “creature,” and must have been, therefore, from eternity.
4. He was “with God”—that is, he was united to him in a most intimate and close union before the creation; and, as it could not be said that God was “with himself,” it follows that the λόγος Logos was in some sense distinct from God, or that there was a distinction between the Father and the Son. When we say that one is “with another,” we imply that there is some sort of distinction between them.
5. Yet, lest it should be supposed that he was a “different” and “inferior” being—a creature—he affirms that he was God—that is, was equal with the Father.
This is the foundation of the doctrine of the Trinity:
1. That the second person is in some sense “distinct” from the first.
2. That he is intimately united with the first person in essence, so that there are not two or more Gods.
3. That the second person may be called by the same name; has the same attributes; performs the same works; and is entitled to the same honors with the first, and that therefore he is “the same in substance, and equal in power and glory,” with God.